73 thoughts on “Channel LSV – ROE Draft #5”

  1. Barely back stateside and already giving us another top quality draft video. LSV, you really are the man.

  2. My jaw was on the floor when the Training Grounds was passed up first pick, and Tristan was the only one discussing it on vent, as its an absolutely ridiculous bomb in the U/W or U/B leveller decks.

  3. Bummer on the mana-screw. At least it shows that you’re mortal like the rest of us, LSV. Good stuff as always.

  4. You should backseat draft next time and let Tristan have the pilot seat instead. Would be very funny.

  5. ‘Kor-Line Slinger doesn’t really tap anything relevant’

    You do realize that at the point you make this statement it is capable of tapping your entire deck -Deathless Angel, yeah? The slinger can tap nearly every evasion creature, which is always relevant.

  6. how good would that deck have been with training grounds 2x time of heroes 2 cliffhavens and a teacher. ppl seem afraid to jump into u/w levellers and im not sure why.

  7. @Casey:

    You can tell by the random message he got during drafting that lsv actually played this draft before even going to GP D.C…. Still, it’s nice that they’re spaced out. I love the weekly dose of drafting goodness.

  8. Loved the draft. The drafts are always more entertaining when LSV has someone with him. Please keep them coming.

  9. I hate to say it, but this is the first time where I felt the picks made were pretty bad. Drake Umbra is vastly overrated here IMO; UW is best as the leveler deck. Training Grounds, Knight of Cliffhaven, Venerated Teacher were all passed over for less synergistic cards. I really could not understand what was going on.

  10. good keeps,,,just the luck of the draw,,,think i would of boarded in the outrider against him,,2/6 blocks pretty good.

  11. Scooped too early against the Crusher. Coulda ripped island for the narc. =P

    Thanks for the vid. I avoid white like the plague, so it’s cool to see a pro put it together.

    Tristan doubles the entertainment valu, so I hope he becomes a draft vid mainstay.

  12. I agree with dave. You should let Tristan take the pilot and you can backseat. I think it would make for a wonderful video. Great stuff btw! Love all the vids

  13. Yeah you definitely missed some good picks for that archtype. Drake umbra is fine in G/U. Teacher, training grounds and those knights would have been better for sure. Oh well, thanks for the videos.

  14. You and TSG seem to be pretty good friends. You certainly seem to be having more fun making these than making the videos alone. Certainly a better back and forth than you had with Mashi and Riki (nothing against them) That being said it definitely seems to lead to some decisions that I feel you wouldn’t have made on your own. I definitely feel like first picking Training Grounds is less risky than keeping your M2G1 opener, laughing while you did so :p

    I’m not complaining. I actually really really like the dynamic of you and Tristan commentating. But since there’s already something of an atmosphere of just two buds hangin’ out playin’ some Magic, why not take a risky pick like P1P1 Training Grounds every once in a while? Worst case scenario the draft doesn’t end up going that route and you’ve only wasted one pick to demonstrate to people who would normally instagrab that card (me) why that’s not always a wise first pick. 😀

    Either way, keep up the fantastic pace with these videos, please. ROE is miles beyond the last… what, 6(?) draft formats. M10/ZZZ/ZZW for sure, at the very least.

  15. Thanks for the draft. I didn’t like that M2G1 keep though. I hate mulliganing but sometimes you just have to.

    Pretty awesome deck by the way, I wouldn’t have been surprised if it had won it all.

  16. Really fun as usual, this is definitely the thing I look forward to most on the internet! RoE limited is pretty much the best ever so it would be great to see a lot of these. Keep it up you guys are awesome!

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  18. The double commentary drafts are probably the best thing on the internet about magic right now, so i would do them as often as possible.

  19. The play you guys made in the 2nd game of the 2nd round seemded strange. Playing time of heroes and leveling the vindicator was really strange. If you just play the angel and beat for 4 with 2 griffins he drops to 8 and is dead on board. In this situation you still have 3 blockers, so you still scoop to removal, but you give him a lot less time.
    anyway, nice videos!

  20. Can’t believe some peoples comments on training grounds, yes its a bomb in the leveller decks, but if you don’t get enough levellers its a blank. Drake umbra is good in any blue deck so is a far less risky first pick

  21. Match1g1 and match2g1 keeps were just wrong. Those were seven card hands with high risks. The deck had a good curve and mana, and it was very consistent with multiple good cards as 2-ofs, so the average six card hand is going to be good. When you have such a good deck, why would anyone want to count on getting lucky?

    I always mulligan to six if I have a 50 % or greater chance to get really screwed up, and I’m more willing to take risks at six cards. But never with seven.

  22. I have a phrase when I’m not sure whether or not to mulligan, “LSV would keep it.” Doesn’t always work though…

  23. its funny to watch how Tristan diplomatically tries to put his opinion into it (and i agree with him alot) but Luis just continues to pick what he likes in a heartbeat 🙂

  24. Yeah, like LSV did not cooperate at all in this draft, and TSG was nearly 100% with every pick in retrospect. Pack 1 was pathetic because LSV had such bad reasoning and sent terrible signals

  25. Sometimes I watch these videos to calm my addiction for magic, sometimes I watch these videos for lolz, sometimes for learning, and sometimes I watch these videos for both.

  26. The drafting wasn’t done too great but that probably was a result of this being done more then a week back already. They probably just recorded a couple drafts when ROE got out on MODO and saved them for when he was busy with something else.
    Anyway the video’s are one of the best feature’s of the site, still I’d would be great to get some of the channelfireball crew in the same draft to see something from multiple angle’s. Like LSV, tristan and ochoa in the same 8-4

  27. Tristan always seems to be making the right play imo. Would be nice to see more of lsv’s reasoning for not going with Tristan choices like the last draft video. I really like it when the obvious “right play” is reasoned out to not being the best option.

  28. I am pretty close to completely sure this video was made with the intention of making bad moves and bad picks – on purpose, either to see if people would notice and learn something by it, or just to have fun. The “the red cards suck”-comment, whilst not even considering Brimstone Mage, seems pretty far out, along with quite a few other picks. The worst, however, is the keep M2G1, which is just horrible, as the draw isnt even _that_ good if you draw the consecutive lands, and just flat out loses a lot of the time.

    Am I seriously the only one to consider this? LSV, admit it, man!

  29. hindsight is 20/20, but those mulligan decisions were really greedy. Also, I’d take the Guard Duty over Deprive. Your offense all flies, so it’s a 1-mana pacifism.

  30. I don’t think they he made the video with the intention of making mistakes. I think he was just having fun and didn’t want to take it seriously. You can here him say when he keeps that hand that he would never keep it in a pro tour and we all know he loves blue so it’s really not suprising he took a blue card first. I don’t think you should watch this video if you’re looking for good technical play but it was definitely entertaining.

  31. @Caleb,,,didnt scoop to early against the crusher,,the anialater made them loose

  32. xsv: Would’ve dropped them to one plains, rip island for narc. Just like I said (jokingly, it’s still a lost position.)

    What a troll.

  33. hi, lsv & tristan

    you guys make an awsome team at drafting and i love watching your videos they are not only helpful but great to watch; thx for making these vids and keep doing what you do!

  34. What a god awful draft…

    Training grounds is a slam dunk 1st pick if you're in UW levelers, and due to the fact that it’s in your 1st pack you have to take it or simply forget about that deck and go after another arch-type.

    Forcing UG, if your dead set against UW, was the way to go and a better signal to the people to your right than shipping arguably one of the best cards for a leveler deck and then going and drafting a leveling deck anyways.

    The fact of the quality of cards that ended up in the deck should be an indication of just how easy it is to get leveler cards in these drafts.

    Contrary to what others have said, I find it more frustrating to hear Tristan giving sound advice and being more or less dismissed by LSV than if LSV was doing the draft solo. If Tristan is the guest Commentator/Drafter than at least give the things he says some weight instead of “oh, I don’t like that card, let’s move along” with a bad pick/signal.

    Lastly, Lineslinger is not a bad car in this format, if you had 1 or 2 in your deck you could have tapped down the mana elf, tapped equipment targets, tapped walls, etc…The card has a ton of usage in this format.

  35. As an added note, please don’t take my comments as anything other than some constructive criticisms. I love that you guy take the time to do these videos, and as soon as I set my system up I will be cranking out some videos also.

    I would rather see winning strategies/deck/videos than losing ones, I can watch someone one lose anytime I want just by playing the game myself, I make tons of bad decisions/plays.

    Seeing a losing video/draft, while instructive in it’s own way, is not as instructive as a winning video/draft. LSV is not supposed to be fallible, he’s supposed to be superhuman (sort of) in these videos. He’s supposed to show another level of play that ordinary players can aspire too, not brought down to their level.

  36. Lol I dont really mind him goofing off, it’s kind of funny. I guess you could complain if this were a paid subscription site, but one goofy draft video isn’t going to kill you.

  37. I think they made the right call on the Drake Umbra P1P1. Taking Training Grounds is just too risky and is only going to get played if you end up in the right archetype. Drake Umbra will get played in pretty much any blue deck. If someone else is in levelers, it’s not going to work out for you. For instance, if the guy they were passing to picked up the Training Grounds, they probably ended up with a terrible deck since LSV/Tristan were cutting off the levelers.

    I would like it if LSV would elaborate more on some of the suspect decisions he makes, though I suspect he was just having a lot of fun and wanted to get to playing with this draft. I enjoy the dynamic of Tristan suggesting the clearly good pick/play and LSV explaining why he thinks the not so clearly good play is actually better.

  38. p2 p3: There’s a reality spasm in the pack! That card is soooo awesome. While it’s not a first pick in any way, the pack was pretty unexciting except for that card and you didn’t even consider it? At that point you had quite a few dudes, so it would often be quite simple to just tap out for lethal EOT. I would also pick the knight over the merfolk, but that became obvious later in the draft^^

  39. I was really surprised when you didn’t pick the training grounds, from my experience it’s the best card you could want in the UW/UB levelers. In one of my casual drafts i went a solid 4-0 finishing 3 of the 4 rounds before the other players even finished game 1 of their match, my deck contained 2 training grounds, 3 dawnglare invoker, 2 time of heroes, 2 hada spy patrol, 2 venerated teacher and a bunch of the best common levelers like skywatcher adept, halimar wavewatch and Knight of cliffhaven all of which are insane if you have training grounds and time heroes in your opening hand, it was the best deck I ever drafted

  40. Not to be rude, because I like both of you guys, but please don’t draft with TSG anymore. I have a feeling that if you were drafting by yourself, you would’ve realized how unkeepable that 1-lander was instead of chumming up with your buddy and chuckling past your mana screw.

  41. I like the videos but some editing would be nice…take out the long stalls where the opponent is doing nothing. It took over 30 minutes to watch at work. Thats way too long to be watching mtg videos while pretending to work.

    *Lawl at myself*

  42. I enjoyed the dual commentary as always, easily the best video’s on this site and perhaps the best Mtgo video’s period. Still i think TSG has to be listened to more, ignore the fact that he is basically always right, its just logical that his input should be given serious consideration due to this being a 2 man show… Otherwise keep up the Epic vids!

  43. This draft was swiss-cheesed with errors from both sides ( atypical). I believe that these draft videos with tandem Tristan and LSV are more entertaining, and perhaps more educational since we often get to see the spike v. timmy argument play out in front of us. I don’t expect to see LSV win as often though.

  44. Another great draft vid! I do love the TSG LSV combo package. Keep up the good work and better luck next time.

  45. I CANNOT GET ENOUGH OF THIS! (still don’t know if I would fork over cash for it though)

    Please get PV and the gang to do some of these. I know PV’s english is a bit broken (or at least he seems to think so) but his articles are beautiful and if he had a wingman it might help him/them to communicate what is going on.

    I loved how you kept it real. I think people underestimate how difficult decisions are when you are drafting, and use their hindsight devalue early picks.

  46. @kirblar: there is in fact good reason to shy away from slam dunking training grounds, UW levelers is severely overdrafted. However, ignoring a card like that and then drafting levelers anyway seems a little loose.

    WRT cliffhaven vs merfolk skyscout, I actually like the skyscout a little more. Total mana investment for your 2/3 flier is a little less, and its ability is actually really good (give something vigilance, or increase total mana by 1 if you have something to do in both mains). Both of these abilities are very relevant in UW because creatures like makindi griffin can attack and block pretty well, and more mana to level up is always welcome.

  47. Taking the umbra 1st pick was a great decision… you don’t know you are going to be UW levelers. I don’t know how many times I have tried to force the archetype and been stuck with W/R instead to very underwhelming results. At least the Drake Umbra is just good on any guy.

    More proof that he didn’t know he would be levelers was the unwillingness to take the Teacher. I love how hindsight is 20/20 but you have to go with what is given and LSV obviously approves of G/U way more that trying to force an archetype by first picking the Training Grounds.

    Keeping the 1 lander was a very poor decision, but he got there with his 2 lander in the first match, so maybe LSV was feeling lucky :p Anyone with an inkiling of fun in them will keep a hand like that from time to time.

    Thank you for these drafts, I love comparing my early picks to yours to see where the first 8 cards would end up. Although I do disagree with a lot of your picks, your track record proves that you must be right more often than me so keep up the good work 🙂

  48. Such loose keeps…you should come down to the island and we can make a few of these vids. Or maybe when I come down to LA in a couple months. Itchin to play a lot these days :D.

    I’ve definitely taken the Training Grounds first pick gambit before over a good playable and it definitely bit me in the ass before. In general, it seems better to go with a pick that you know will definitely go into your deck and drake umbra could even be good enough to splash if you’re a base green deck as an additional win condition. If the guy in front of you happens to go into levelers in front of you, you may be forced to draft levelers over more powerful spells just to back up that first pick. But then again, if you wanna goof off and have fun I just say GUN IT!!!

    Oh and that red leveler guy isn’t very good as I initially thought and I feel it was between heat ray and the umbra.

  49. Unfortunately Lashknife Barrier is nowhere near as good when it doesn’t draw you a card, costs 6, and still does absolutely nothing as a creature (whee, for 18 mana it’s a 2/5!). Hedron-Field Purists borders on unplayable.

    I like your first pick though! Drake Umbra is the second-best limited blue card in the entire set (only behind Sphinx). It’s in my top 15 overall.

  50. Line-Slinger also gets annoying things like Guard Gomazoa out of your way. It’s not just for defense.

  51. Training Grounds is not just good with levelers – it makes cards like Dawnglare Invoker and Wildheart cost 2 less to activate and can put them online fast to lock up a victory.

    Always a first pick in the first pack IMO. There are too many good cards with activated abilities in this format and it will always be useful no matter how the rest of the draft goes.

  52. Game 2 Round 2 You should have sided in deprive, it destroys the ramp deck’s bombs.

  53. most people in here obviously have no idea about ROE draft. The picks were RIGHT. I even hate teacher, a lot of times its just the random vanilla. And the other times you get completely blown out by a staggershock and its still a vanilla. People surely overrate that guy.
    Aside from that I wasnt surprised to see the draft end like it did. The last time I was forced into UW (yes forced, it’s among the worst possible color combinations) I won 1 lucky game against somebody with 2 plains 1 student of warfare 1 time of heroes and 1 oust for his boar umbra’d beastbreaker. The problem really is once you stop putting pressure on your opponent and he casts his Broodwarden it stops you dead in your tracks. And that happens a lot if you don’t hit all your landdrops.
    Plus you die to all the brimstone mages, guul assassins, guard gomazoas.
    You have to pair blue with removal, not the worst color.
    So in my opinion lsv did everything right (passing training grounds, the teachers) except the random keep with the 1 plains.

    (Sidenote: UW levelers dont mulligan well. Most of the time you might as well just concede if you ship back your first hand)

  54. @All the people saying taking the Umbra 1st pick was a good decision, I REEEEAAAALLLLYYY don’t get it…

    We’re talking about a creature enchantment…2 sets ago, if I told someone that I was 1st picking a 5 mana creature enchantment that wasn’t an instant win…I would have gotten laughed out of the building, have the ideas of 2 for 1s completely gone out the window because of this new set…

    Has something changed in the last month that ROE has been out that made instant removal a taboo, has Black and Red mana been removed from the game, does Blue not have any bounce spells, has white completely been neutered of it’s creature control…?

    I guess I need to go back to school on MtG, because either you guys are giving REALLY bad advice, or I’m missing something…lol

  55. @oz

    You’re missing the fact that its not a two for one if it resolves. There are plenty of opportunities to play auras when they are tapped out and then at that point it is not a two for one

    What you missed (or are ignoring) is the totem armor part. That makes them much better than the auras of yesterset.

    Also… Going back to school seems like a good idea for you.

    Lastly – Yes, red and black mana has been removed from the game.



  56. Can someone please explain to me what is so bad about smite? i would have thought it would be the better pick over regress in the second pack. It is actually removal.

  57. PlatypusPlatoon

    K, I’m like a week late to the party, but Match 2 Game 1 was HILARIOUS. Super entertaining. Never laughed so hard at a draft video.

    Keep up the awesome work.

  58. That door slamming in the background sounds like crap on your mics. Do mind that in future recordings….

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