Initial Technology - Can’t Spell Elves without uh…Kenji?

July 19th, 2009

Unfortunately, the results from this latest batch of Nationals aren’t exactly what I was hoping for. As the title of this article alludes to, I was kind of hoping to running Elf Combo back to a win, but that was before everyone in Japan chose to play the deck (and it won in Australia too). I really did like Elf Combo, and the addition of Elvish Archdruid spiced it up considerably. Now that it isn’t under the radar, it will lose a significant advantage. I didn’t think it was an unknown deck by any means, but I also didn’t expect people to be packing nonsense like Ethersworn Canonist either. I’m not dismissing it completely by any means, but if I wasn’t seriously considering alternatives I wouldn’t be writing about it.

With 3 Elf decks in the Top 8 of Japanese Nationals, one piloted by Kenji himself, and 2 Elf decks in the Top 8 of Australian Nationals, one being the winner, it is pretty hard to argue that Elf Combo isn’t one of the decks to beat now. This is part of the problem of doing too much preparation when big tournaments like this are set to happen before yours. We have been testing, all the while knowing full well that the results of this weekend would likely affect our choices very significantly. Instead of Kithkin being one of the top decks, it now seems like Five-Color Control, Faeries, and of course, Elves, are the big three. Kithkin is certainly still a deck, much like Red Aggro or Cascade decks, but it might not be as big as previously assumed. It had a pretty dismal track record in actual Nationals, despite winning a bunch of the grinders. Take that, Cedric!

Of course, Elves being a deck to beat is not a good thing at all. Instead of being merely another Tier 1.5 deck or what have you, it is firmly in the center of everyone’s consciousness now. I didn’t expect Elves to be a secret on the scale it was in Berlin (where just about everyone who knew about it played it, and those who weren’t playing mostly didn’t know about it or expect it), but I was hoping to not play a deck that everyone was aiming for. All is not lost, but I now don’t see the harm in writing a bit about the different Elves decks that did well this last weekend, and some of the choices I agree or disagree with.

Spells

The easiest category to look at is spells, since there really are only three spells to choose from:

Primal Command
Manamorphose
Path to Exile

Four Primal Commands are a given, as every single deck included them, much like we always did. I can’t really see touching these. I also think they are the only spell needed, as I have been very underwhelmed by Manamorphose in testing, and never really considered starting the Path to Exiles. Path might be a decent call now, if you expect people to do something as extreme as maindeck Ethersworn Canonist, but I don’t think we are there yet. Having access to them in the sideboard is probably good, although Last Breath is an interesting alternative that Tomomi Shiraishi played. Manamorphose just doesn’t do all that much, and I don’t think it’s worth the slot. Your mana is fine, color-wise, and while it does occasionally generate mana with a bunch of Nettle Sentinels in play, it always just seemed like you were giving up a slot in your decklist for little gain.

Creatures

First, the creatures you must have:

4 Devoted Druid
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Heritage Druid
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Ranger of Eos
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
3 Regal Force
1 Cloudthresher

Before this weekend I would say that four Regal Force is a must, but Gilt-Leaf Archdruid does offer the possibility of going to three. I haven’t tried the Archdruid myself, so I can’t really attest to its effectiveness or lack thereof. We did play without any Devoted Druids for a while, but it seems like a mistake, particularly in light of these results. Being able to hit Primal Command or Ranger plus a one-drop on Turn 3 is pretty sick, and Devoted Druid lets you generate a bunch of mana without overextending. Other than the four-ofs, you have the tutorable Forge-Tender and Thresher, both of which add a ton of value to your Rangers and Primals at the low cost of one slot.

There are a few optional creatures as well:

Noble Hierarch
Mirror Entity
Gilt-Leaf Archdruid
Scattershot Archer

Like I said before, I can’t attest to the inclusion of Gilt-Leaf Archdruid, although I have to admit that it does seem a bit unwieldy.

Noble Hierarch is quite good, and most of the decks featured a few of them. They give you more chances to hit Turn Two Elvish Archdruid, which is sick, and make it that much more likely to hit five mana by Turn Three, which is an important number. Being able to start Primal Commanding them is pretty important, and upping your chances of doing so is nice. They also give your attacks a bit more punch, which particularly helps when you are trying to activate Mosswort Bridge.

Mirror Entity seems mostly unnecessary to me, as I never actually had trouble winning the game once I went off. Having a random kill card just doesn’t matter, so the only reason I would include Entity is for the beatdowns. It does make any random elves into quite the force to be reckoned with, but this deck doesn’t have that much trouble winning once you get a bunch of elves out usually anyway.

Scattershot Archer seems a little narrow, although gunning down Spectral Procession is kind of cute. I assume it was included to help fight Faeries, as most of the time that you get to Ranger into Archer the White decks have an Anthem effect out, so it isn’t great in those matchups. I don’t think adding a random Archer is going to help all that much against Fae, and I wouldn’t look to maindeck this.

Lands

Hideaway Lands (Mosswort Bridge, Windbrisk Heights)

Both of these lands are playable, but the right number of Windbrisks is tough. I don’t understand playing less than four Mosswort Bridges, since it entering the battlefield tapped (I actually wrote “coming into play” and went back and erased it…I’ll get used to these changes sometime) isn’t that big a deal, and it is actually pretty easy to trigger. I often Ranger for two Nettles to get to 10 power, since that is seven right there. Evoking a Cloudthresher is also a sweet way to run it. Windbrisk is a little tougher, since while attacking with three guys isn’t that hard, it only adding White mana is kind of annoying. I think one or two is probably fine here.

Dual lands (Ancient Ziggurat, Sunpetal Grove, Wooded Bastion)

Nobody ended up using Ancient Ziggurats, but we had them for a while while testing. They add Green on Turn One, which is really key, and still tap for White mana. Basically, a terrible Brushland. They weren’t bad, but the awkwardness of them plus Primal Command and their inability to cast White sideboard spells makes them not make the cut in the end. They are worth mentioning though, since if your sideboard is low on White non-creature spells, than Ziggurat really isn’t too bad.

Sunpetal Grove and Wooded Bastion are both blanks on the first turn, although they do add mana just fine later in the game. You really want to be able to cast a Turn One guy, but you do need some number of these guys. If you want to play a Windbrisk Heights, than I wouldn’t go further than 3 Sunpetal Groves, although it is possible that the fourth Grove goes in over the first Heights. Wooded Bastion is pretty much a four-of.

The maindeck that I like:

4 Devoted Druid
4 Elvish Archdruid
4 Elvish Visionary
4 Heritage Druid
4 Llanowar Elves
4 Nettle Sentinel
4 Ranger of Eos
4 Regal Force
2 Noble Hierarch
1 Burrenton Forge-Tender
1 Cloudthresher

4 Primal Command

4 Mosswort Bridge
4 Wooded Bastion
4 Sunpetal Grove
8 Forest

Believe it or not, Michael Jacob had this list proxied up even before Kenji and Oiso played it at their Nats, although it is unsurprising that Kenji had basically the best list (See, I assume we also had the best list!). I like a straight 20 lands, 4 Primal, 4 of each of the key pieces and the 1 Forge-Tender and 1 Thresher as tutor targets. That leaves two slots, and Noble Hierarch fills out your one drops perfectly. We didn’t have Windbrisk Heights, but they are certainly good enough to try. I realize I am not providing much tech here, since Kenji’s lists don’t usually need endorsements, but I did find it funny that he came to many of the same conclusions we did.

That just leaves the sideboard, which we of course haven’t settled on. I would go so far as to say that anyone who has their 75 settled over a week before the tournament is a fool or a liar, since sideboards are generally the last thing fully hammered out. I don’t mean we haven’t thought about a sideboard, since that would also be foolish, but that we just have an idea of the kind of things we want, and are nowhere near solidifying a 15. Last-minute tech or info, scouting, and just more testing will determine my sideboards, usually on the night before the event.

Path to Exile / Last Breath

You want access to one of these, and before this weekend I would have just said Path. It is much more versatile, but Last Breath is infinitely better in the mirror. Being able to effectively kill one of their accelerants is something Path doesn’t really do, although I am worried that Last Breath won’t be able to kill an Ethersworn Canonist with Honor of the Pure out.

Burrenton Forge-Tender

No real reason not to max out on these guys, since they drop the hammer pretty effectively against Red decks and Fallouts and whatnot.

Great Sable Stag

Faeries is definitely a tough matchup, and three or four Stags helps greatly. Being able to drop a turn two Stag (especially off a Hierarch) is pretty sick, and it gives you a legitimate shot of beating them down. I usually hate when combo tries to transform into beatdown, but Elves is so creature-based that it really kind of is a beatdown deck, so it can transform pretty well. Stags plus Threshers plus Guttural Response makes Faeries’ life pretty difficult.

Guttural Response

In general I think that Cloudthresher and Stag are better, but a mix of the three is going to be the hardest for Fae to deal with. I wouldn’t play more than two of this.

Cloudthresher

A few Threshers keeps Faeries honest (well, as honest as those pesky things get, anyway), and being able to punish Sower of Temptation is pretty important. Without Threshers they can just Sower with impunity, and a Sowered Ranger of Eos blocks Stag pretty well.

Oversoul of Dusk

Haven’t tried this, but Kenji seems to be crushing with it, so it’s worth looking at. Does a pretty good job of letting you be the beatdown against both Faeries or Red decks. It makes me miss the deck I played at PT Hollywood even…maybe if I can get some Behemoth Sledges in there.

Platinum Angel

The winning list from Australia had this, and even though it seems suspect, can you imagine how awesome it would be to drop Platz and have them be on no outs?

Mark of Asylum

Another way to stop Fallout, this seems pretty much just worse than Forge-Tender. It does stop all their burn forever, but I like blocking with Tenders and searching them up.

Qasali Pridemage

This one I like, since having at least some way to kill an enchantment or artifact is good. Who knows when they are going to pull out Everlasting Torment or some random thing like that, and the fact that it kills Canonist or Honor of the Pure against Kithkin is pretty nice.

But what are you playing next week?

I can’t give everything away, and only unfortunate circumstances led me to writing this article. That and uh, my duty to the audience? I can’t say what I will be gunning next week, but if it is Elves it will likely be pretty close to this, and I wouldn’t feel too bad about it. I’m not quite crafty or devious enough to have an even techier list that crushes this one, although if our brewing is successful this week, I make no promises…

LSV

16 Comments »

  1. Seems like Faeries is the place for you to be. I like the list from Spain, with Bolts and Spouts. Not sure its good, but it looked interesting.

    Comment by Eric Weeden — July 19, 2009 @ 10:50 pm

  2. Nice article. My list is very close to yours. I used to run Dauntless, but with Wrath leaving the format Burrenton only makes sense, even if he doesn’t net us a card from Regal Force. I have one more Burrenton MD, as I like having the chance of running one out before I start extending, and Ranger necessitates some developement. Also, one can get pulsed or something like that. Most games I have lost with this deck have been to turn 3 Volcanic Fallout.

    My mana base is different. While Grove and Bridge are awesome on their own, multiples can mean very slow, draggy starts. I dropped Bridges and run a couple Plains. They haven’t been missed. The deck can mulligan aggressively to get powerful starts, but having 12 situational lands hinders this. Basics are the new tech.

    I have been really happy with 2x Reveillark in my board. I ran them pre-M10, and they only get better with Archdruids in the deck. Speaking of Overrun, a Garruk as a one-of in the sb (sometimes main) is a viable option, too.

    Comment by Caleb Durward — July 19, 2009 @ 11:36 pm

  3. im sorry im just to dumb to see how this deck wins…… i dont see the win condition can some one please state what it is ??????

    Comment by Joseph — July 20, 2009 @ 1:59 am

  4. Alright joseph the way this deck wins is you put a bunch of elves into the redzone tapped and your opponents life total drops from twenty to zero.
    aggro is the new combo sir.

    Comment by jeff — July 20, 2009 @ 2:18 am

  5. tons of mana + primal command for regal force + draw your deck = put all your opponents lands on top of their deck via primal, reshuffling your graveyard, etc. its complicated, but much like the one from previous extended. you don’t win the turn you “go off” but your opponent won’t be able to win either since you’ve put their lands on top and stuff.

    Comment by strong sad — July 20, 2009 @ 2:31 am

  6. er, you go off much like the version from last year’s extended season, but you don’t win the turn you go off (usually).

    Comment by strong sad — July 20, 2009 @ 2:32 am

  7. so its swing for the win because i understood the extended season combo i just didnt see like a off win condition….

    so i assume its swing with 15 elf 2-3 due to the new lord

    Comment by Joseph — July 20, 2009 @ 2:41 am

  8. Open the vaults is just sick. If u don`t believe me, proxy it and test.

    Comment by K — July 20, 2009 @ 7:49 am

  9. i find that budget elves is soo faaaaaaaaaaar worse then the top list. i feel weird buying 5-10$ archdruids that will only be useful for 2-3 months. i know i need to pick up sunpetals anyways since it has nice art work and having sets of every dual land is always welcome. i guess i shouldn’t play elf ball because by the time i collect the remaining cards needed it will rotate away really quickly

    Comment by Dan — July 20, 2009 @ 9:45 am

  10. Is r/g elf warrior playable with Paragons and bloodbraids?

    Comment by Travis Cullum — July 20, 2009 @ 12:44 pm

  11. LSV, the mirror entity is finisher as well as a way to loop the combo. Without the mirror entity you cannot use regal force more then 4-6 times, which actually is revevant sometimes. By using entity for 0 with 1 heritage druid, 1 ranger, 1 primal and 3-5 other elves in hand and about 15 mana floating(which is prety easy once you combo) you can combo off again, assuring your opponents can’t kill you(I once had to live through 6 4/4 spectral tokens cracking back post combo). Its worth the 1 slot he takes up.

    Comment by Jason — July 20, 2009 @ 5:47 pm

  12. What do paragons do to help you combo off? A couple +1/+1 counters aren’t going to make much difference.

    Bloodbraids on the other hand… I doubt they’re worth it, but it would certainly be *fun* to go r/g.

    Comment by Luke — July 20, 2009 @ 6:06 pm

  13. The thing is, I don’t think you need to play 11 Regal Forces. The situations where you need to go actually infinite are so rare that I think you lose value when you attempt to cater to them.

    It is a common mistake that people make, but winning more doesn’t get you anything that a normal win doesn’t. In Berlin, I actually sided out Grapeshot in most matchups, since once I went off I would dump a bunch of dudes on the table, Thoughtseize them a few times, and hit them with a Jitte’ed guy. That was close enough to a win; having a card that was just a win condition was a waste of a useful slot.

    That being said, if Mirror Entity is good in situations where you would lose otherwise, like as a beatdown tool, then maybe it is ok. I don’t think it is needed, but I guess it isn’t the worst card. If you are putting it in solely to allow literal infinite Regal Forces, you are doing it wrong.

    Comment by lsv — July 20, 2009 @ 8:08 pm

  14. Does anyone have any information you have about the matchup against 5c control? I’ve been testing with my group and I’ve been doing pretty well with control against this (4x fallout, 3x burial main with 4x spout coming in from the sideboard) but I don’t know if those results are accurate because I don’t think anyone in our group has played the elf deck enough to be good at it. Surely this deck wouldn’t have been as successful as it is if it just lied down and died to Faeries AND Control.

    Also, is boarding in sweepers the best/only way to board against this? (Aside from Canonist) Thought Hemorrhaging for Commands or Regal Force just turns it into a bad Elf Beatdown deck, right?

    Comment by Chris — July 20, 2009 @ 9:03 pm

  15. Why aren’t Silence and Gaddock Teeg getting sideboard consideration? Silence can stop the mirror mid-ish combo giving you an extra turn or two to match them or win. its also good vs decks like faeries by eating a counter at worst. its also a nice card to have after you combo in any matchup by not giving your opponent a chance to respond with something like hallowed burial or firespout. As to Teeg i realize he shuts down primal but in my testing i have found 2 in the sideboard to be strong. The fact he shuts down 12+ in both the 5cc and cascade matchups is relevant, especially if they side in thought hemorrhage to get your regal forces.

    Comment by Matt — July 21, 2009 @ 1:08 am

  16. I actually meant to infinite primal commands. Maybe it is wrong but I have to say mirror entity has helped me more often than not. It is useful as a beatdown tool but I am fairly certain I like having it more than a md cloudthresher like a lot of the lists from the Japanese nationals.

    Comment by Jason — July 21, 2009 @ 11:02 am

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